What weapons can bind

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What weapons can bind

Postby Daeruin » Thu Jan 12, 2012 11:04 pm

So I was thinking about binds the other day and wondered if it's only a sword thing, or if it even applies to say pole arms, axes, and blunt weapons. I can't really picture how it would work for two axe fighters or two mace fighters. Or a sword vs mace, for example.
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Re: What weapons can bind

Postby Galloglaich » Fri Jan 13, 2012 2:44 pm

Yes any weapons can bind, but you do bring up an interesting thought... in a bind between a sword and a mace the mace is going to seemingly always have the advantage, it's more dense and has more mass, so it's like the whole thing is the 'strong'.

When you bind with two swords, you try to put your strong on their weak if you want to push / control them... or your weak on their strong if you want them to push you (so you can misdirect them or twitch around to the other side)

But it's interesting to think about.... the sword would be much quicker to react in a bind I would think, like for example to wind in or 'mutate' an attack, but the mace should have the ability to beat aside a sword easily .

That is one of the reasons I gave maces pretty good defensive stats.
But I wonder if you could get more granular with binds? Or maybe that is better saved for computer games.

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Re: What weapons can bind

Postby drkguy3107 » Fri Jan 13, 2012 5:35 pm

I think maces would suck at binds. They can't mutate a strike into a thrust, unless they put a lot of pressure on the opposing weapon, thus telling your opponent exactly what your going to do. However I think the question is unimportant since you don't bind with small weapons.
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Re: What weapons can bind

Postby Daeruin » Fri Jan 13, 2012 7:40 pm

Hmmm. Interesting. So there are differences in how weapons act in a bind. But you're right that it's probably not worth getting into that level of detail.
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Re: What weapons can bind

Postby drkguy3107 » Sat Jan 14, 2012 5:43 pm

Well with smaller weapons there is less reason to stay in a bind. For example, with a knife you don't see binds, it's often easier to simply block the opponents arms/wrists with your own rather than block blade on blade. Since maces are so short, I don't seem them actually staying in a bind, it would be easier to just disengage, since the weapon is actually long enough to really pursue you. Now with a longsword, if you disengage from a bind you are going to be opening yourself up to a thrust or some other blow. This is also true of swords, smaller swords usually have less bind techniques, since at the ranges that you can hit with such weapons it is usually easier to simply wrestle. You see that in a lot of the messer videos.
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Re: What weapons can bind

Postby Galloglaich » Mon Jan 16, 2012 2:48 pm

yeah but there are a lot of other things you can do from a bind besides the standard fencing techniques we tend to think of (winding, thrusting, zucken and so on), including some very effective but brute force techniques which are universal.

You can get a bind and simply force your opponents weapon out of the way while you close for grapple for example or disarm or strike them with the 'pommel' (or equivalent). If you are fightinng someone with a hafted weapon, you can sieze their haft after a bind (you can also do this against a sword but it's a bit more risky) but this is a very common technique against spears or staves for example.

There is also the glissade which is a kind of a long beat, you can do that pretty effectively with a mace or a war-hammer, flinging the opponents weapon aside (offline) to open them up for a decisive counter.

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Re: What weapons can bind

Postby Galloglaich » Mon Jan 16, 2012 3:06 pm

drkguy3107 wrote:I think maces would suck at binds. They can't mutate a strike into a thrust, unless they put a lot of pressure on the opposing weapon, thus telling your opponent exactly what your going to do. However I think the question is unimportant since you don't bind with small weapons.


So yeah to continue from what I said above, i don't think maces suck at binds, but you can't do all the same thing from a bind as you can with a sword, which is different. This is where the MF come in. So the MF for winding or mutierin are effectively limited to swords or sword-like objects for example.

Maybe I should make a glissade MF though...

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Re: What weapons can bind

Postby drkguy3107 » Mon Jan 16, 2012 5:29 pm

How would that work mechanically?


Also, I wasn't saying that you can't beat a blade away, but you lose a lot of options and that makes you more predictable.
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Re: What weapons can bind

Postby Galloglaich » Wed Feb 15, 2012 8:24 pm

drkguy3107 wrote:How would that work mechanically?


In the rules, to get these certain Martial Feats, I include in the pre-requisite that it has to have both a C and a P primary attack, which eliminates most maces, or even that it has to be a sword or that it has to have double-edges or whatever is actually necessary to do the action.

Also, I wasn't saying that you can't beat a blade away, but you lose a lot of options and that makes you more predictable.


I think that is true, although you may gain certain other options.

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